HE REMEMBERS BEING WITH GOD AND SAYS, “GOD IS UNSPEAKABLY LOVING” – Christian Sundberg

Okay, awesome. All right, so we’ll jump into the Q&A now. I think we’re really good here because I usually have 40 questions—I’m not joking—and I only see like maybe 15. Okay, we’ll see. We’ll be good with time. But I want to first say that you were referred to me. Somebody was looking at Aaron Green’s interview with me because, obviously, pre-birth stuff. And they said, “Please do a Q&A with Christian Sundberg.” So I want to say a big shout-out to Archaic St3 for making this happen.

I also want to say to people, because my channel is so small, when people like you—who are basically like a celebrity in regards to this world, the spiritual world—when you say yes to me, I know that you’re the real deal. So I just want to thank you so much for taking time out to have this discussion so I can fully understand.

So, you had these memories up until the age of five, which is pretty—not to say normal, but I just did a whole thing with pre-birth, and yes, up until about four or five, before you start going to school and getting acclimated, we tend to hold on to these memories. But they diminished, and then you started meditation and were able to recollect all of this information. Is that correct?

Christian Sundberg: Yes, yeah, that’s true. But I’m careful with the word usage though. I wouldn’t say that I meditated and therefore I was able to recollect it. It’s more like, as I meditated—meditation is just a word for the deep investigation of what you really are, what consciousness really is beneath all thought—so it was more like I gained more and more familiarity with what I really am. And then, once I knew experientially and was in touch with what I really am, the pre-birth memories were just there. They were so normal. In fact, the human thing, the human experience, is like the strange thing, you know?

Interviewer: Okay, and did they come all at once or just gradually?

Christian Sundberg: Basically all at once. I’ve had other pieces open up here and there, but it was basically all just there at once, and it was very normal. I just started talking about it to a few people, but it didn’t seem strange to me. It was just like, “Oh yeah, that’s who I am. That’s cool.” And then I mentioned it a couple of times, and someone said, “That’s extraordinary.” And I said, “It didn’t even occur to me.” I was like, “Oh, I guess it is from the human point of view.” But it was very normal. It would just be like someone saying the sky is blue. It’s like, “Okay, I know.”

Interviewer: Awesome, awesome. And before we get into the meaty questions, what type of meditation were you doing? I’m sure people want to know.

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, so we tend to get hung up on categorizing. I guess the closest term would be Transcendental Meditation. That’s probably the closest term. But I feel like we want activity, we want process, we want form. So, which form did you do? Really, it’s a consistent investigation of your consciousness of self beneath all thought and all emotion. And that starts as being able to choose something to focus on. So that’s why Transcendental Meditation can be important—picking a mantra or a shape or something in your mind and just focusing on only that, putting all your attention on it.

You’ll find that thoughts come right away. When you haven’t practiced meditation, you don’t have control over what you’re thinking because you’re just thinking about lunch, and now you’re thinking about work, and you’re thinking about this person who insulted you or something. The thoughts just keep coming. But if you practice choosing your focus, without knowing it, you’re actually slowing the thought momentum. You’re reclaiming conscious control and awareness. It’s like becoming awake, actually.

And then, eventually, not too soon, you can drop the form of focus—whether it’s a mantra or a shape or whatever—and just focus on awareness itself. Your awareness itself. Don’t make up anything. Just deeply look there and feel it and know it in a non-thinking but deeply full, active, present way.

So, I don’t know what word you put on that. I do recommend a meditation exercise in my book that’s very similar to the one recommended by Tom Campbell, who is the consciousness explorer whose work kind of started me down this path. He recommended a meditation exercise, and that’s kind of what started me down the path.

But I highly recommend it because it’s one thing to think about spirituality and to read the books. It’s okay to do that, but there’s nothing like actually discovering, even in a tiny way, who you really are. It’s such a deep well and has such a reward to it. So, I highly recommend it as a form of investigation, actually, not just as a practice.

Interviewer: I like that. And there’s a similar form of meditation that’s mentioned in the Ra Material, the Law of One, just FYI for people. So, I think there clearly is something to having that mantra or that focused image that you pay attention to. So, I think there is something there.

All right, so you had all these remembrances, and maybe say downloads to some extent. Have you experienced other realms and dimensions?

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, I know it sounds really strange to say that because as soon as you say that, it’s like, “Oh wow, that’s looney bin stuff.” But strange to me, just FYI.

So, I have, and it’s very normal now. Out-of-body experiences can be at least as real as fully lucid human earthly waking life, which is pretty darn real. And even far more real. It’s not like a shady dream or something. When you’re in those environments, the realness, the lucidity, the veracity of it is completely self-evident.

So, I’ve experienced other realms, and they are very real. And afterwards, when you kind of come back, so to speak, to Earth, this is like a black-and-white movie by comparison. So, then people are like, “Oh, is that real? Is this real?” Man, this is like the more dead state, actually. We talk about dead people being off, and this is alive, but this is actually the more dead state in the sense that the amount of limitation that we experience while human is huge.

So, this is the much more limited state of being, and our spirit naturally engages systems with much less limitation and therefore knows much more of itself. And yes, that’s real.

Interviewer: Okay, and did you get to these states through meditation as well, or something different?

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, I mean, once again, it’s okay to say through meditation if we’re thinking of action leads to result. But I don’t like drawing a parallel because the thing is, the human wants to think, “Do A to get B,” like go from point A to B by doing something. That local causality type action is not really what we’re talking about. We’re actually talking about a move towards consciousness itself, which transcends the local.

And in that, yes, the soul engages many reality systems naturally. So, I’m putting it that way only because I’m hesitant about saying, “Do this thing, and then you get to leave your body.” Well, your body is just an experience occurring within you. So, deeply explore yourself, and then you may find spontaneously—or even in small amounts at first—that you are already engaged outside of the veil right now.

Interviewer: Yeah, so I asked that question, and I guess it’s good that we reiterate that because some people are actually using processes, whether it be binaural beats, and that’s okay.

Christian Sundberg: And I don’t mean to say that we shouldn’t use processes. I’m only very sensitive to the language because there’s already a built-in misassumption when we think, “Oh, I need to do this action and get this result.” I’m just trying to lift that up because the shift in consciousness, the shift in your mind, actually, of just knowing that this is very close to you—this is not far, it’s not hard to get, you don’t actually have to do the thing—it’s actually more like look away from this thing.

And so, I’m lifting that up because then that is the way you see it. It’s like if you’re watching a movie in the movie theater, you don’t really do something in the movie. You instead return to seeing that, “Oh, you’re sitting in the seat. You weren’t actually in the movie. Oh, it’s just a movie. Oh, I see.” And then once you’re in the seat, then you have much freedom that’s just naturally available to you.

Interviewer: Yeah, yeah. Okay, and do you think this is something that most people who are in this Earth game or play or whatever you call this experience—do you feel like most, if not all, people should be working on understanding what’s outside of this experience? Or is the whole purpose to experience and to just be in it? Or is it dependent on the person?

Christian Sundberg: I can’t—yeah, it’s dependent because I can’t—there’s no categorical answer in the sense that each soul is unique, and their journey is unique. And I think both are important. So, I’ll start with the second one first because we’re here to be human. Like, we’re here to be veiled. We’re here to go eat our food and go to the store and pay the bills and put on clothes and stuff. You know, that’s like what we do. That’s what we’re here to experience, and that’s good.

In fact, I’ll just make a comment here really quickly that this whole pursuit of spirituality is not about going and getting something else that’s not here. It’s actually about accepting what’s here so deeply and accepting yourself so deeply—which is very alert, non-rejecting—that you widen yourself to even more.

In fact, there’s a TikToker named Yesui who I think is quite amazing, and she said something like, “You don’t leave this bandwidth and go to that bandwidth, the spiritual. No, rather, you accept all bandwidths.” And as you do that, the amount of bandwidths you get increases.

So, I think that’s important to say because these two things are not contradictory. We can be fully present and fully experience the human experience, and yet, to your first one, it is valuable indeed for sure to investigate your consciousness itself.

And I’ll just say one thing like why that’s so valuable. Yes, we’re here to be human, but here’s the thing: our true nature is love and peace and joy and freedom. And that’s good. That’s really good. So, it’s a bit like asking, “Can we benefit from more peace and love and joy and freedom?” Yes, we can.

And meditation is simply the word we use to describe getting back in touch with that native love and peace and joy and freedom. So, yeah, that’s very powerful. It’s very freeing and empowering.

Interviewer: And that ties to two different questions. So, from your vantage point of what you’ve learned of reality, do you believe that we have higher aspects? Like, is there maybe the oversoul, and then there are different levels of us? Some of us are just extremely advanced but at higher levels, but at the same time, we’re here in this low realm. So, do you feel like we are just this individual soul or spirit in this space, or do we have this multi-dimensional aspect where we have higher levels of ourselves?

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, so we do have—okay, we call it an oversoul. Let’s just call that your higher self for simple terms. So, yeah, we have a higher self. But the higher self is not some other being. It’s you. This is really important because then we tend to think, “Oh, well, I’m just this upset human here who’s got bills to pay, and I just have a headache. I’m not the soul. Can’t my soul see I’m pissed?”

But the thing is, you are your soul. You are your soul seeing out the eyes of this thing that we’re doing here, this human thing, and seeing through the limitations. And yes, that soul, that higher you, has much more to it than just your human character. It just means that you have done and are doing other things too. But it’s you. It’s still you.

So, yes, the human character is just one small piece of the much larger multi-dimensional whole. Absolutely. But I also think it’s important not to divorce the human personality, which feels separate—of course, I know it feels separate—but I think it’s important not to divorce that separate-feeling human personality from the whole. It’s still the you that feels like you to you.

And that’s one of the things that’s so empowering about meditation. When you investigate the real you, you’re not making up anything. You’re going and seeing, “Who am I?” And as you do that, that’s a very deep well, and there is a lot there that you may not see at first because of how deeply we are veiled here. And that’s okay. It’s not multiple things. It’s just all one you.

Interviewer: Like, I don’t have a lot of questions, but I want to ask you five questions at once. It’s very difficult right now for me. I understand that.

Christian Sundberg: Oh my God.

Interviewer: So, hopefully, I don’t forget any of these. But okay, just jumping into something that’s been—because I realized that nothing is by coincidence—so I’ve been talking on some of the NDE forums, and I came upon somebody who had a very intricate NDE, and their downloads are off the charts with what they understand about reality. But they feel very much so that they should not be sharing this information with others. Like, they really just feel like it’s for their own growth, and it’s kind of like, “I’ll stay in my lane, and good luck to the rest of you.”

And I think they use the analogy of like a monkey pulling a fish out of the water so that it can breathe, and ultimately, the fish will die because it can’t breathe air. But on the other hand, you have the Bodhisattva Vow, where somebody who is enlightened decides to go back and help others to become enlightened.

And I’ve heard you in previous interviews mention that—well, not even well, in this one, you mentioned that we are in an awakening cycle. Yes. And I’m assuming that you mean like the Kali Yuga, like we went—I don’t know if that’s a big assumption, so you could let me know if that’s—I don’t know what you mean by Kali Yuga.

Christian Sundberg: Sorry, okay, so this is gonna have to be another question.

Interviewer: Okay, but you’re saying we’re in a waking cycle, and clearly, by you being in all these interviews, it shows that you’re trying to share and to uplift, right? So, do you—and I guess it’s kind of tied to the previous questions—do you feel as if there is the need for a greater awakening for more people to either hear these—not to push it on them and kind of just say, “Here, take this or die”—we’re not doing the whole Crusades or that kind of thing—but just trying to uplift the all? Like, what do you think in regards to either keeping information for yourself, worrying about your own enlightenment, or helping the collective of Earth?

Christian Sundberg: Yes, that’s a really good question and something that I have personally navigated very carefully over the last six years because there are definitely times when it’s not appropriate to share for whatever reason. And I tend to be very—I try to be very true to how I’m intuitively led. Like, there are some aspects of my experience I’ve been nudged not to share, so I just don’t share it. It’s okay.

However, I like the metaphor of the monkey pulling the fish out of water. It’s not helpful for the fish. It’s not helpful for some people to turn over their worldview and dump it upside down. They are a loving brother and sister. Why would we need to do that to them?

So, I acknowledge that. But meanwhile, however, our true nature is love and peace and freedom and joy, and that is what we’re moving towards. And Earth has a long history of fear, which is, you know, painful. It’s an ego. So, the ego rises out of fear, and we have enshrined egoic process in our institutions for thousands of years.

And fear hurts. Fear is insane. Let’s just put it that way. Whether it’s small fear or large fear, it’s insane, partly because it’s based in a perception that’s not even fundamentally true. It’s always based in some negative perception like, “I’m powerless,” or “I’m not worthy of love,” or “There’s something.” And those are not true.

So, fear is based in something untrue. It has no true foundation. It has no foundation. But here we are, for thousands of years, running around fear-driven. Which, by the way, just as a tangent—I’m getting down another tangent here—but like, the main thing we’re here to do is to evolve the quality of our intention choice-making towards love, real love, and past fear.

See, because the fear is not even real. So, to your question, is it beneficial to—let’s call it—intelligently, carefully help others to see where fear is not necessary and to empower them? Because that’s what this is about. And I would say yes. I feel that it is important that we remind each other of who we really are because there is so much power in that.

Now, I know that it can stimulate fear. In fact, right now, we are going through this awakening process, and it’s high friction because fear wants to hold on. Ego wants to hold on to the beliefs. That’s what ego does. “Don’t threaten my beliefs. I believe that. Nope, you go away, or I’m gonna bonk you over the head.” You know, that’s how ego thinks.

And right now, there’s a lot of new ideas flooding the collective consciousness, and for some, ideas like this are not helpful. What comes to mind for me is a very personal story, actually. The short version is that when I went through my awakening at the age of 30, and over the next eight years, it was very personal. I didn’t share it, but I began to feel called to share it. I began to write the book, and I knew that I needed to share eventually.

And like I said, at age 38, I did share. But at the time, my wife’s parents—even now—are not of the same mindset, and I respect their religious beliefs. However, they have—I have unintentionally caused them, in quotes, a huge amount of discomfort and pain because they believe that by my sharing this message, I am threatening the souls of my children. You know, because they don’t believe—you know, the way they believe in Jesus Christ—and they think, “There must be demons involved. There must be demons involved.” You know, always, that’s the thing.

But the thing is, I had to make a decision. Like, am I gonna let—because it’s not me causing it, actually. And I know that it’s actually more that I am simply presenting something that catalyzes friction. It stimulates opposition, unapparent opposition. But it helps others.

So, I had to make this decision, and in fact, when I made the decision, I had no thought about the number of people or anything like that. I only felt the quality of intention. I felt spirit, and I felt the nudge like, “This is a message of love. This is a message of love.”

And when you experience this and you feel our multi-dimensional nature of love, you just want to grab everybody by the shoulders and say, “We are multi-dimensional beings of love, and you have nothing to fear. Like, nothing. Nothing to fear.” I wanted to shout that from the rooftops.

And so, finally, when I made the decision to share, I thought, “Okay, maybe five people will hear this, and that would have been enough.” That would have been enough because it was about the quality of intention, the desire to actually help. And I deeply feel that I feel called in my bones to share the message of love and freedom and to give power back to others.

Because the thing is, right now, we all think all this power is out in our systems—our governments, our society, our beliefs, or religious institutions, or governmental institutions, or companies, or money, or whatever. Okay, guys, like, the power is yours. And you have nothing to fear. Like, that’s what I want to share. That is the most important message.

This has nothing to do with me. It has everything to do with who we all really are and what our true nature of love really is. And so, to your question, all the way back around in a big circle, yes, I feel that’s valuable to do, even as I acknowledge the importance of discernment with how we do it because I know that it affects certain people in ways that are not helpful.

And if someone’s not ready, that’s okay. That’s totally fine. Like, I don’t have an agenda. I’m not selling anything. And love does not require the other person to change. You see, love does not bonk them over the head. It doesn’t need to make the fish breathe air. It loves the fish.

And the thing is, though, if we love the fish, the fish is made of love too. So, what happens is the other tends to feel it, whether they can consciously identify it or not. And they might rise up out of the water a little bit on their own. They might grow little legs, you know, turn into one of those little cute little mud creek guys—mudskippers or whatever—because love calls us.

We’re all called by that freedom and that love, whether we consciously identify it or not. And it’s okay that we are deeply wrapped into form here, into thoughts and beliefs and identities. That’s the name of the game. It’s okay. It’s okay if it’s not received when there’s some form association. That’s fine.

But meanwhile, I do feel that it’s very valuable to share. 100%. And like I said, you’re helping me even now because I’m in that zone. Like, I go back and forth, and I’m definitely right now where I’m like, “I went off this planet. I’m done with this game.” It’s okay. I’m running out here. A lot of us feel that way.

It’s ironic because pre-life, we see what an absolutely incredible opportunity this is. And to put it in Earthly metaphor, it’s like there’s a huge line to get in here. A huge line. There are only a very small number of slots, and you say, “Oh, there’s billions of us.” That’s a very small number compared to the size of the multiverse and all the souls that exist.

And to be given the chance to play a human life is like winning the freaking lottery. I’m not kidding. You feel like all that chose you out of everybody, and that you are given the honor to go down into the deep muck and to actually be and love and shine and be your authentic self. And to grow. You’re given the opportunity to grow in incredible ways.

I can’t stress this enough. The value of the human experience is so huge. So, it’s ironic that so many of us that are here, especially the more sensitive among us, we just want to get out sometimes because, look, this is kind of a mess.

Well, it’s okay that you feel that way. Where is your resistance? Where are you saying no to this limitation set where you’re not being yourself, which is joy and love and peace? And it’s okay if you choose more of that joy and love and peace.

“Oh, but I have good reasons. I can’t.” Okay, do you really? Like, you know, we can look at our reasons and the things that we think are such good reasons to not be ourselves. Like, I’m saying, if we align with who we really are and we be ourselves, life is no longer this horror show anymore because it doesn’t even really super matter what’s happening outside in the sense that you are yourself anyway, and you’re shining with joy and freedom anyway.

Interviewer: Yeah, yeah. So, it can be done. I’m not making light of the feeling, though.

Christian Sundberg: No, no. And I mean, I’ve heard this. I do a lot of research, a lot of reading on NDEs and all these different experiences people have, and you are not the first one to say that Earth is like—you know, like people in line to try to get on this hell planet. And it’s just—it’s like you said, it’s—I wouldn’t call it a hell planet. Let’s call it a highly limiting simulation.

It’s actually not—oh, I like the look on your face. But so, because it’s not actually charged—let me just comment on this because the thing that makes it a hell planet—there’s only one thing that makes it a hell planet: fear. Is the planet’s fear or is it ours?

Well, it’s not the planet. It’s not the context. It’s ours. It’s our—to put it in a more direct way, it’s our unevolvedness that makes this hell. Not the planet.

Interviewer: Okay, explain to me.

Christian Sundberg: All right, so you say that we are all love, like on the other side, complete love. And it’s good that I’m asking these questions because people are gonna be thinking, “Where does all the fear, the darkness, the evil come from? Where does it all come from?”

It’s not a separate thing. It’s not a fundamental thing. The fundamental thing is love and peace and joy. If you look at consciousness deeply, you find that it’s made of love and peace and joy and freedom. And consciousness, spirit, is the fundamental substrate.

I’m gonna pause there because that’s super important. Okay, then something happens. Consciousness falls asleep into something else that it’s not. So, we come here to be something that we’re not, which is what the veil permits. And it permits a set of limitations to be imposed upon consciousness such that consciousness has the potential to buy into a perception that isn’t true. And that causes fear.

And fear gives rise to all the thousands of manifestations of ego, darkness. So, fear is just a simple word, but what I mean by fear is that part of us that is unevolved, that rejects, that says no. Just like I did a few seconds into my life before I even had—nobody taught me anything. I was in the womb. I didn’t know anything. I just felt, and a perception rose up: “I am not the whole anymore. I have no power.” And fear rose immediately in that.

But that perception wasn’t true. You see, in my second experience, it was what God showed me—that that was not true. It was like a deep illusion that I was entertaining. So, where does it come from? It comes from being something we’re not and buying into that.

And then, once we buy into it, now the small self is desperate to fix this huge problem. Now we have this huge problem. Now we’re separate from each other. We’re separate from the whole. We’re not loved. We’re not free. Now there’s a huge problem.

And so, what happens? The ego rises up. That’s just a part of us that says, “I’ll fix the problem here. You’re powerless here. Now you have power. Look, because you can—I don’t know—hurt the person next to you. Don’t you feel better now? Because look, now you have this proof that you can hurt this person next to you, so that means you have power.”

Or, “You don’t have value, but hey, look, now you have money in your bank account. Doesn’t that make you feel—see, now you have value.” Or, “You’re afraid that you don’t know that you’re going to actually exist past the end of physical death, so here—oh, here’s a religious belief. Now, if you believe this, you’re taken care of. Don’t you feel better now that you believe that?”

See, that’s what we do inside instantly, so quick. This is not a slow, necessarily slow process. Very quick, as the ego portion of us rises up and tries to grab onto something made out of straw to cover up that fear.

But what we’re here to do then is to see through that, work through that experientially, and to discover there actually was nothing to be afraid of. And our true nature remained what it is, except now we’ve known that, and we’ve experienced the opposite of what we are. And through that, we’ve expanded that far.

We’ve—you could say that duality carves out the cave so that there’s space for us to grow into. But the true nature, the true substance, can’t be anything else. Another metaphor might be, you know, water is always water, even if you freeze it down into an ice cube. You lower its vibration, you lower its temperature, now it’s changed form. Now it’s become dense. It’s crystallized.

That’s what consciousness does here. We crystallize down into this thing. And then you say, “Well, how is there something other than water?” Well, there actually isn’t. It’s just that its temperature changed, its vibration shifted. That’s all. It’s still water. And we are still water. We’re like ice cubes within the larger ocean. We didn’t actually go anywhere anyway.

So, I hope that kind of speaks to your question, like, where did it come from? Because it’s not like a sub—here in duality, we like to think there’s hot and there’s cold, there’s light and there’s dark. Light and dark is not a terrible metaphor because darkness is not a thing. Darkness is just where there’s no light. Similarly, fear is not really a thing. It’s just when we’ve looked away from love towards a perception that’s not true.

And then, that is part of the game. That this illusion or this challenge or catalyst is part of the game. It’s written into this Earth. The limitation is written into the game. The fear is not the—well, but it’s seen that the fear could happen for sure.

I mean, okay, I’m saying that it’s not like we come to be afraid. We come to face the limitation and see if we can not be afraid. See if we can know our true selves and choose the loving choice even in the great limitation. That’s what we’re here to do.

Because the fear is not a real thing. It’s kind of like if you—let’s say you go into an amusement park. There’s this amusement park near my house that has like one of those walk-through scary houses where there’s dark tunnels. Yeah, I haven’t done it in a long time. When I was a kid, I loved it. You walk through these little tunnels, and there’s little thingies grabbing you, and there’s lights, and there’s angled rooms, and you know, and when you’re seeing it, you feel fear.

And it’s actually exciting because you know it can’t actually hurt you. But in this reality, you think it can hurt you because you can get stabbed, you can die. It’s pretty—it looks pretty serious. Like, the fun house, though, eventually through integration of that experience, through experience itself, through growing up—you could say, which is evolution—through growing up, now if I go back into—I went back into that house a couple of years ago with one of my kids, it was not scary.

Obviously, it doesn’t need it. I don’t need to tell somebody why. If they say, “Where did the fear exit from this house? Show me where the fear exited.” There was no fear in the house. The fear was mine. You see, the house was just janky and slanted and dark and full of weird things that can touch you.

Here, in this context, we’re wearing a body, and we’re in a society that is not understanding very much of what we really are, and we have a lot of “us versus them” mentality. We’ve normalized predatory economic behaviors and all these things. That’s now our context. We made it, by the way. We, the players, made it. Not some other being. With the billions of players who have played this game, this is what we’ve built.

It’s just what we’ve done with it. It doesn’t have an inherent badness to it. It’s just what we built. And now that we’re here, can we see more clearly? That’s the question.

Interviewer: So, again, three questions that you asked. But I do want to mention because we did mention it—so, you said the awakening process. When I mentioned the Kali Yuga, I don’t know much about it. I just hear it a lot, and it’s apparently in Hinduism. It’s the different stages or world stages. There are four different ones, and that the Kali Yuga was the horrible one, the one that was just full of fear and corruption and all that kind of stuff.

And that supposedly, eventually—the date keeps changing, it depends on who you talk to—we’re going back into a positive, so it’s kind of like an up-and-down kind of cycle, and that we’re going back into the positive golden age where things get better, and we’re more awakened and conscious of who we really are.

So, with that said, it kind of sounds like what you’re saying—the awakening process—that maybe that’s why we’re doing that. We’re trying to pull ourselves back into what we truly are and remember, at least.

Christian Sundberg: Yes, and okay, yeah. We are trying to do that because ultimately, all of this journey through the worlds of form is back to love. Like, we wouldn’t—it feels like we left love when we’re here. But in the big picture sense, it doesn’t make any sense to leave love unless you can come back.

That’s a very crude way to put it, but I’m saying it that way because it is an absolutely 100% false assumption to think that we are stuck outside of love. We can’t be. It’s our true nature. So, then, the reason I’m saying it in the context of your comment is we may dive deeply into worlds of form for hundreds or thousands of years, but that is about returning.

It’s about the journey of digging out that cavern so deeply that we then integrate the whole thing and return to what we are in an even bigger way. You could say it’s a little bit like saying, you know, like doing a pull-up or something. Like, well, are we pulling ourselves up? Well, yeah, that’s what you do during a pull-up exercise.

You may be hanging there, and your body may be heavy, but you try to pull yourself up. Like, that’s the natural direction. That’s the natural thing to do with a pull-up. Here, the natural thing for us to do is to integrate all of this, to heal all the fear, to allow love and peace and joy and freedom to be more fully actualized here, and to return to it as what we already are, even through this place.

Like, we can’t actually lose it anyway. It’s just a big simulation.

Interviewer: Are we gaining in love? And because I want to bring it back to an analogy that you mentioned before in regards to weightlifting that I thought was amazing. I love that idea that we’re putting on this extra weight, which is this world, this very dense world, in order to try to—I guess lift up the love, like to show, “Okay, no, I really am love. Like, I’m proving that I’m really love,” right? To get past that challenge.

But so, the question to me is, is it like the coal that becomes the diamond? Are we here to become better or more improved or more enlightened with this love light?

Christian Sundberg: Yes, or okay, yeah. The short version is yes. So, there are two things to this though. First is, water can’t actually be more wet. So, what I mean is, consciousness is already love and peace and joy and freedom, and it doesn’t need to do anything. There’s nothing required of you. There’s absolutely nothing required of you. You’re totally free.

Okay, then, subsequent to that, out of curiosity and out of the sheer joy of who we are and out of our creative natures, we may create entire universes of form and work through them. And through doing so, expand what is possible, expand what we could know, expand what we can feel, expand what we can do, what we can be.

That’s what we’re doing. That expansion is happening through this experience. Like, the being I saw on the other side, his nature was so overwhelmingly beautiful and full of freedom and power, and I was like, “I want to be that. I want to do that. That’s amazing.” That is amazing.

So, when you ask that question, because it feels like when you look at a being like that in the non-physical, it feels like they were given that state of being. But it’s not that they were handed the state of being. It was that they were handed the weight. Like, you know what I mean?

Like, if you saw an Olympian who’s strong—physically strong—and you say, “Who gave that to you?” Well, nobody gave it to them. What they were given was the opportunity to exercise, to lift a weight, to go running. And then, because they did that, they grew. They became stronger. And that is how it is spiritually.

So, the body of the spirit, the body of awareness—you put it this way—the soul has qualities. It has capability and knowing and wisdom and abilities, I guess would be a crude word. And so, through pitting itself into something potentially challenging—oh, that’s the most tasty type of exercise possible because now you’ve challenged that thing, which is like—you could say the soul is beyond challenge, actually, in a way.

So, it’s so precious to be given an actual challenge. You put it that way. Like, you’re because the soul is a part of the whole. It’s a part of God. Like, what can challenge God? Nothing. It has no opposition. It has no enemy. It has no adversity. It has no need. No need at all.

So, then, how does it grow if it wants to within itself? By creating a system of duality that it integrates through. And that is what we are doing through this experience. And that’s one of the reasons why the human experience is so valuable because the limitations are so high.

So, it’s like lifting a thousand pounds on the bench, and then you go to a thought-responsive reality system like the astral or something, where a thought becomes a thing instantly, and you’re able to wield certain intentionality, certain quality of being, that no one who has not been physical can wield because you’ve done the hard stuff.

Maybe like throwing one pound when you used to throw a thousand. It’s not hard. It’s not hard for you because you threw the thousand pounds, you know? So, being human is like being offered a thousand pounds instead of ten. And only those of us who are very bold and very brave and very—the word “warriors” pops into my mind—we are the warriors who decide to come down here and do this.

I’ve heard Suzanne Giesemann in her NDE say we’re like fighter jet pilots flying our jets 20 feet up off the ground, upside down. That’s true. It’s like that. I mean, I’ve heard where souls return from Earth, and they see an arena that’s full of people applauding them. And I always wonder, like, why are they applauding them? So, that could explain that.

Interviewer: But so, this—I have three questions that came just out of that. So, one, are we growing God? Are we expanding God in some kind of way? And which sounds very blasphemous. I’m even surprised I’m saying the word, but yeah.

Christian Sundberg: Well, so I think that boils—I think so. I have to say two things at once again. God can’t—so, God—we are—say, okay, the water is the ocean. When we talk about God, we’re talking about the ocean. Every soul is a drop of water in the ocean. We’re talking about the entire ocean.

We are pieces of it. On one hand, water doesn’t get more wet. It’s just what it is. It’s already perfect. On the other hand, yes, as pieces of the whole, as we grow, more is expanded and added to the ocean too. So, we are participating in an expansive process that contributes to the whole. Yes.

Interviewer: Okay, and in regards to regressive souls, I’ve heard this before as well. You know, talk about dark spirits or demons or people who just really let the ego bring them to the lowest of lows. And people have experienced this. I’ve felt this. I mean, thankfully, not as much as maybe others, but I know that there are dark energies out there or dark souls out there.

Where’s my question here? Can I pause you real quick?

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, so it’s not—let’s just—I want to be careful. It’s not that souls are dark. It’s that souls may be unevolved, and they might then have a lot of fear. And a lot of fear might mean a lot of ego and a lot of hatred and a lot of anger and a lot of all that nasty, gunky stuff that we call darkness.

So, the nature of the soul is always love and peace and freedom and joy. That’s true no matter what. No matter what fear, no matter what creature you meet, what being—whether physical or non-physical—that may have fear, depending on the system they’re operating in. No matter if that’s true.

And by the way, the fear is commensurate with the level of limitation. So, high limitation environments like ours have high opportunity to provoke fear because there’s so much limitation, so much pain.

Okay, fear is not integral to that person. It’s not native to them. It’s not native to them. But it is insane, and it can get very asleep. Ego is very asleep, and it falls into these patterns of anger and hurtfulness. But I don’t personally draw a huge distinction between small fear and big fear. It’s all insane.

So, my fear—where I might feel anger at somebody if somebody does something to me—maybe if I feel a glimmer of anger, I’ve actually fallen asleep into insaneness, even though that may seem different than, like, Hitler killing millions of people. It’s still ego trying to do its best with what it’s been given out of fear.

Now, we like to call that force evil. And I understand, in our duality, sometimes that’s useful to identify the light and the dark. Of course, I don’t mean to say it’s not useful. However, I think we’re doing each other and all that a disservice by inappropriately assigning fundamental realness to the evil and to the darkness. It’s not fundamental.

It does happen because we have a high system of limitation and because we have a lot of fear. It happens. It rises up.

Interviewer: Yeah, so for the soul that fell into that and is, you know, as opposed to evolving, is devolving—do you feel like, on the other side, they are still at the same level of love? Or do you feel like it’s possible, on the other side, that they may have actually gone backwards in some ways, like the water evaporating?

Christian Sundberg: No, no, no. The water can’t evaporate. But the thing is, okay, so over a certain period of time, devolution may seem to happen. We tend to be sensitive to time. So, if we see someone who is evil their whole lives, that’s a long time, right? Not really. It’s actually a pretty short jaunt. It’s a short walk in the park.

So, I’m just lifting up that, always, one way or the other, this is the key: one way or another, whether it be one minute, one day, or 100 lifetimes, we all will evolve back up and find ourselves back. But even more now.

Like, all processes of form cannot help but serve the expansion of love in the end. This is so, so, so important. There’s no such thing as a process within form that doesn’t ultimately serve love. It can’t. Nothing can escape the use of love in its evolution because love is the real thing. It is the truth. It has the power.

Spirit has the power. Fake power—someone wielding fear and ego and, like, pulling out a gun and shooting you in the face—that may seem really terrible in the local sense, but that is very limited power by comparison to spirit.

And fearful action—now, okay, okay. So, there are, in the divine wisdom of source that is so deep, systems of what we call karma in place, which facilitate the integration of the fear such that the being returns to fullness of love over time. Those laws operate inexorably because you can’t escape who you are.

So, if you have acted unevolved, if you are an unevolved being, and you get thrown into a form system that turns you around, and now you’ve got all sorts of ego shenanigans going on, then that’s who you are. You’re an unevolved being. That’s okay because the system then is built—not only in a given lifetime but even beyond it—to help that being to face and process that and heal even through that.

Like, when I saw the potential for this life—oh my gosh—and this fear that I wanted to integrate, like I said, I was a very damaging, egoic monster in a previous life. I hurt many people, and I died in agonizing death in that life because of the fear. But from my perspective in spirit, I can see, “Oh wow, I have deep fear in there.”

But I knew that if I could process that and heal it and integrate it, I would be—oh my gosh, I cannot describe this—the amount of love expansion that could occur within me and the whole would be huge. Huge. And the opportunity was so amazing that I valued the opportunity to come back here and to suffer a trauma in my 20s.

I knew it was very likely that I would suffer a health trauma in my 20s, and it would give me a chance to re-experience this fear. That did happen because I could see that that was an incredible opportunity. I knew it would be very, very challenging, but I was excited because I knew, at that point, what the soul always knows, which is that we are multi-dimensional beings.

We are immortal. We have absolutely nothing to fear. We have nothing to fear. But we need to get in and get our hands dirty in order to actually process that and integrate that.

Interviewer: There’s no good vocabulary for this. I love that you’re saying that because, for starters, when you think about us having—like you said, multi-dimensional—we have all these alternate lives or parallel lives happening at the same time. And I’ve heard from people that if you do the work in your current life—what you’re experiencing right now, what you think to be your current life—that it can domino effect into the others and help the whole.

And I like that you’re saying even bigger that what you might take on in this life and surpass—and you know, like pass that level—you’re helping the all. Like, helping everybody.

Christian Sundberg: Yes, you are. Yes, you are absolutely. And I want to make it even more—you’re absolutely correct. And I want to make it even more specific. When you process your crap for real—I’m not talking like for pretend, I’m talking like for real—when you really get in there and own your crap and feel your feelings and own yourself and be authentic and own who you are and heal, you are helping the entire collective consciousness of humanity to heal.

Because you are a part of that pond. Call the collective consciousness a pond within the ocean. When you shift—you’re not trying to shift, actually. When you do this, you’re just trying to move more towards love and process fear. Right? You’re trying to be more yourself.

When you really, really do that for real—and whatever that means for you, it could be a very small thing—it’s not about size. All of size is simulated anyway. What’s important is consciousness and the quality of intention it’s wielding.

So, if in the quiet of your bedroom, you face your fear, you are helping the entire Earth to heal. That is a very, very powerful and important message. Like, it actually—because you could think of it like a bunch of candles in a room, maybe, and many of them are very dim. If you start shining more brightly, every other candle in the room can see that, and then it feels pulled to shine a little more brightly. And it creates a cascade.

And we are all participating in that right now. And actually, this is a very hopeful message because if one awakened person is much more powerful than many who are asleep—in terms of how they affect the collective consciousness—it’s disproportionately beneficial.

Like, one awakened person has a bigger impact than many who are not, who are just unconsciously going through life. So, if you wake up, face your own fears—like, for real—be honest with yourself, and choose love and peace and joy and freedom in new ways, however you can, small ways, then you are helping.

Interviewer: Absolutely. And do you think that’s the same as shadow work when people are saying that they’re doing shadow work?

Christian Sundberg: Okay, and so—I know that you’re very keen on language and using the proper words, but I’m just curious. Like, would you say that, for each person, healing and loving—if I just said, if you had two things you had to do, say healing and loving—focus on healing and loving your whole life. Is that—does that seem like a positive?

Christian Sundberg: Absolutely, yes. That’s the main thing. Healing and loving, absolutely. And actually, they’re synonymous too. Ultimately, they’re synonymous because healing is like working through something that’s not love and returning.

Like, you have to go through the darkness. See, shadow work—you know, that just means like, go look in the dark closet for real. And I’ve used this metaphor before, but I think it’s pertinent. I’ll share it really quick.

When my father was a little boy, he was afraid of his closet in his room. And every night, he would go to sleep, and he was afraid of the closet because he thought there were monsters in the closet. And then one night, he’s like, “I’m so sick of being afraid.” And he charged into that closet, and he fully expected to be eaten by the monsters.

And he sat on the floor, and he was trembling, and his heart was racing, and he was like, “All right, monsters, eat me. Eat me. I’m sick of being afraid. Eat me.” And the monsters did not eat him because there were no monsters.

It took him many months of self-torment as a kid before he got up the nerve to go into that closet and go see and face his crap. That’s a metaphor for what we do with our fears. It takes us years sometimes of pain and suffering before we finally go, “You know what? I’m so sick of being afraid. I’m so sick of feeling shame. Or I’m so sick of feeling like I’m not free. Or I’m so sick of feeling powerless.”

Whatever it is, we actually go deeply feel the feelings. Let the darkness—basically, we don’t say no when the darkness arises because it will arise if it wants to be healed. Your body, your energy body, it will bring it up time and again. That’s okay.

I’ve experienced that. I’ve experienced such neurochemical lows as my energy body went to heal and integrate this fear that the pain is beyond description. I’ve experienced that. I’ve experienced states where I cannot feel good. It’s not possible. But it’s okay because then that is the context that consciousness is wearing.

Can I not reject that? That heals it. Not saying no to it, but actually being with this present moment, even when darkness has arisen, even when pain has arisen, saying yes to it. That’s shadow work. Saying yes.

Because one other thing—because when you say yes in this now to that vibration, you are saying it to all the nows. That’s you’re saying one life can affect their lifetimes. They’re all happening in the one now. So, if you process—if you face something—not even process—if you say yes to something now, if you open your aperture so wide that you feel something that you never let yourself feel before now—face a trauma that you’ve experienced now—if you do that in this now, you do it for all the nows.

And you don’t have—and you’ll never have to experience it again. You don’t do it to get rid of it, though. It will heal it, but you don’t do it in order to heal it. You do it in order to listen and to feel and to say, “I don’t reject you.”

Interviewer: Yeah, yeah. You totally freaked me out with that story because I have the same exact story as your father. I literally—my brother put a Skeletor glow-in-the-dark head in the closet, and so I was terrified of the closet. And one morning, the family was looking for me. We lived in like a three-bedroom apartment with like 20 people. It was insane in the Bronx.

And they couldn’t find me. They wanted to call the police. Like, “We cannot find her.” And thankfully, I snored back then, apparently, so they started to hear me snoring, and they’re like, “She’s in the closet, hugging the Skeletor mask.” Really?

Christian Sundberg: Yes. So, we had very similar—your father and I had the same kind of conquering our fear.

Interviewer: So, now you’re not afraid of Skeletor masks anymore?

Christian Sundberg: Not anymore. Not anymore. And if somebody brought a Skeletor mask into your room, it wouldn’t need to feel afraid. And it might feel even a little silly.

So, that’s kind of like if someone brings the physical universe into your experience, and you’ve integrated it and not said no—and said yes to everything—it doesn’t need to cause fear.

Interviewer: Yeah, I think that’s this whole moment right here was what needed to be said. I’m getting goosebumps. I have very few questions left. We’re going to be able to close in time.

For people who are advanced—I’m kind of going back to what we were talking about—the soul that has advanced and gone back and is more—whatever that means—more in some ways. Do you feel like they open doors to higher dimensions? Because I’ve heard that before—kind of getting the keys.

Christian Sundberg: Okay, awesome. Yeah, so let’s just say—okay, so if you have known and processed something very low, then that means you are capable of experiencing a high to that degree and more, actually. So, that’s one of—you know, that’s the benefit of duality is that we utilize it as a creative tool, and through integrating that low, we permit a high that otherwise is not knowable.

You see, like, if you never left the light and you were only ever the light and you had no contrast, how would you know what the light even meant? You see? So, you know, it’s like what God offers us is that, well, if you can be something you’re not, and through that, we deepen what we are.

And so, there are reality systems that yes are—I don’t want to say locked, but they’re vibrationally resonant only with those who have evolved to the point where they resonate at that extreme vibration. And that is, you know, that’s done through integration and healing and growth.

Interviewer: Yeah, and then I have a question that’s—I don’t know, it’s kind of a weird question, but again, I read something recently that’s in my head, and you did mention—like, you’re talking about the light, we talk about the darkness. There are some people who say the void is peaceful. It feels like a womb. It’s a great place to be.

And there are others who are terrified and have a whole another experience about it and even say that you don’t want to be in the void. Like, that’s a bad sign if you find yourself there. But then I read an NDE or something last night—it was just mine. I just—I love it. I’m going to make sure I put it on my channel—where she’s saying that the actual darkness—like, I’ve heard this before—I would love to hear your thoughts on this—that the darkness came before the light.

I’ve heard this before where the darkness is where—that the light came from the darkness. And in her NDE, she’s saying that the darkness is actually all the possibilities. And I’ve heard this as well about the void being a place of creation where the light can be created from this dark. Like, okay, that the darkness is uncreated light.

That with a being like us, if we bring our focus in the void and we desire to have light, we can take the—I would say maybe dark matter—I don’t know if that’s the right term—but just whatever that is in there and make it—like, open it into light, create it into light, create into creation, into planets, into universes.

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, let me—yeah, so the void being empty of anything and also pregnant with all possibility is a relatively common experience. So, there’s a metaphor I think that really helps for this. This is Tom Campbell’s metaphor, and I think it explains the void really well.

The void is like a loading screen. So, it’s like consciousness when not engaged in any reality system. So, it’s pregnant because you can load anything on the computer. It’s terrifying for some to go there from a place of ego because it completely strips egoic reference points because you’re no longer the name or the belief or the body or anything that was protecting you from your fear.

It can’t exist in the void. It’s not there. And so, without that, you may feel fear that was already there. The void didn’t make fear. It’s not a fearful place. It’s just an exposing place because there’s no form of protection. It’s just full of—not emptiness, but—we’re getting—this is hard to talk about, of course—but it’s just empty of form and yet full of all potential.

So, when you talk about light—well, any physical experience of light or any sensory experience of light may be created from the void, of course, because now you’re bringing something to nothing. But when I talk about the light of consciousness, I’m actually talking about that which is the fundamental substrate.

You could say the background to the void or the—it’s not a great way to put it—the substance that really truly is. And then the void is what it is—what it looks at when it’s not looking at any form at all.

This is very hard to talk about. Think of it like a loading screen on a computer. It can load any program you want, but when you’re in the loading screen, you’re not your video game character anymore. So, that can be scary if you thought you were the video game character. But the loading screen itself—there’s nothing wrong with it. It’s just full of possibility because you can load anything you want.

Interviewer: Yeah, yeah. And I love the way that you mentioned or described yourself like when—that holy moment that you had. So, of course, I want to ask, what did God look like to you? Or did you see God or an expression of God? But in you seeing yourself like almost like you say—like a sun or like a star. The sun was in me. The sun was in my body. It was in all the galaxies were within me, within us, within God. Beautiful.

Okay, so did you have a sense of what God looked like? Or did it appear to you in a certain way?

Christian Sundberg: So, that’s a very human question because we like to think of, “Tell me what the object looked like because now I understand.” So, objects are given existence. Like, objects don’t have existence. Existence has objects. So, I’m saying that’s a Rupert Spira quote. I’m saying that because it would be incorrect to assign God some words and now that’s what God looks like and not these other. That’s—we can’t do that.

God—oh my gosh, this is so—I could talk for an hour just with poetic language about this. But it is the most personal lover, parent, friend, body that you are and that you are a part of. You are the tiniest little drop within the mightiest thing. And that mightiest thing is absolutely incredibly loving and wise to 10 trillion trillion trillion trillion degrees.

And that thing, when it communicated with me, was not like, “Oh, hi, I’m like a horse or something.” No, it was like the all and beyond. It was not—it was much bigger than just our universe. Our universe is like a corner. But everything in the universe was an expression.

Like, consciousness—wording is so hard. Consciousness is a part of God. All of consciousness, you could say. This is really hard to describe. And everything is known as it is experienced by consciousness within consciousness. So, when you know the full body of consciousness, of course, all forms and their expressions are known within you, and it doesn’t feel strange. It’s very, very familiar.

It’s like a song. It’s like a song of joy and endless bliss and radiance and freedom. And it never ends. And it’s—I know this maybe I’m not being—maybe I’m not being helpful. I try not to use super poetic language because, like, that doesn’t—you know, we got a lot of poetry out there.

I’ll just say that like even the sun—the sun was a very, very, very small piece of this universe, but it was huge, and it had all a consciousness to it, and it was raging with bliss. Like a raging fire of bliss. And it was in me, and it was just so blissful. Oh my gosh, like—thinking about it hurts so much because it’s like, “I want that. I want to go back.” But it’s okay. I’m just allowing. I allow myself to feel that huge distance.

Anyway, so there’s no language that can perfectly articulate it.

Interviewer: I love that. But very sentient. Very, very, very wise and unspeakably loving. So loving that it could just destroy you with love, but it doesn’t. You know, something like that. It’s like—it’s so hard to—it’s so—and it’s so personal to all of us. Like, it’s a thing we all know the most. We’re all looking for God all the time. We just don’t know what we’re doing.

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, like the big problem—the big problem here is that it seems like God is gone.

Interviewer: Yeah, yeah. And it’s not. But he, she, it is not.

Christian Sundberg: Yeah.

Interviewer: I had other questions—not important questions—but I feel like this whole energy here was just so healing, and I loved how you became almost poetic and how you were describing God because it seems like that’s what happens. Like, if you really try to start to describe God, you can’t, but you start going into poetry and prose. So, I love that. I love the energy that came around this whole moment.

And I’m just going to leave it there. I’m going to let that be the last thing that people can hold and take home with them. For the most part, I just want to say one thing to everybody listening: you are that too.

That is the most mighty reminder. If we can ping into each other here and remind each other of the love because even though you may not remember consciously what I’m like trying in terrible words to describe, you know, like deep down, you know. And I trust that you know because it’s what we are.

So, I’m just lifting that up because that is the most valuable message. You know, people always say, “Oh, can you share your story?” I’m happy to share my story, but that is not important compared to this. This is what this is all about—what we really are, which cannot be described.

If we can touch into that even just a little bit here, we will shine that light here in this extreme limitation. The world heals through it. We heal through it. That’s very, very, very powerful stuff.

Interviewer: Yeah, I’ll let that be your take-home message. Yeah, thank you so much. Thank you for the love and for your walk. And thank you, everybody who’s listening today, for being here and for being human today.

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, it’s beautiful. Beautiful.

Interviewer: And how do people reach you? And the name of your book and all that, and then we’ll close off.

Christian Sundberg: Yeah, so my book is called A Walk in the Physical. It’s available for free on my website, awalkinthephysical.com, on the book page, third link down. It’s not about—I just want to share this message though. It is available in print or Kindle or audiobook for those who are interested.

So, I get a lot of emails, so I apologize if I can’t respond or if I respond super late. But my email is awalkinthephysical@gmail.com, and my website, awalkinthephysical.com, has many different talks that I’ve participated in on the talks page if you’re interested.

Interviewer: Beautiful, beautiful. Christian, I just—I feel the authenticity, and it’s—I just thank you so much. I thank you so much for being strong enough to share this message. I just thank you so much, really, truly, from the bottom of my heart.

Christian Sundberg: Thank you.

Interviewer: All right, blessings, brother.

Christian Sundberg: Blessings to you. I felt your energy before, you know, when you emailed me. I try to be—I just try to follow intuition. It’s like you said, it’s not about channel size. I don’t—this is not about size. Yeah, it’s about love and the feeling of what you are doing is powerful and important. And I know you may not feel that way about yourself all the time, but you are—you know, the new age term is a light worker. You know, you are someone who is doing it where you are. So, please be encouraged.

Interviewer: Thank you. I knew I needed this conversation. Like, you’re helping me in a very low moment. So, I thank you so much, brother. I really do. I send you so much—

Christian Sundberg: Welcome, sister. Much love.